21.4.16

Jupiter and the full moon. 20th April.

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Having left the 7" folded refractor out of doors for several hours I started observing Jupiter before it was even getting dark. Initial impressions were of greater contrast in the two main belts than before but without any real detail. In other words they appeared darker but offered no insight into their real complexity. The Galilean moons were more rounded and differed more obviously in size than previously. 

The folded 7" refractor on the MkIV mounting taken by flash and brightened several stops.

There were fleeting moments when there was a hint of twisting and edge roughness in the belts but the entire evening passed without any real improvement as Jupiter climbed steadily higher. I tried the Fringe Killer filter and preferred the view without. Then the Yellow No8 and ND but again without any increase in detail. The odd thing was that I was using the 10mm eyepiece [and the 20mm with the Orion 2x Barlow] without loss of image quality. The image did not 'break down' at 216x as it had done on previous occasions. 

Attempts to capture afocal snaps were a complete waste of time. Jupiter was overexposed and misshapen by glare. The moons were just distorted blobs. The weakness of the OTA supporting battens may be the problem here. Touching the OTA produced flexure and caused brief vibration in the image. The 18mm, 3/4" birch plywood battens were only a temporary idea to get the OTA mounted. The top bars have to be rotatable to allow the OTA to be easily lifted on and off the MkIV's 60cm, 2' long cradle. Though there is no reason why I shouldn't beef up the lower crossbars for more stiffness.

The moon was full and blindingly bright as it rose behind the hedge. I tried a range of eyepieces once it was clear of obstruction but there was no great detail to be had. Perhaps the seeing was simply soft?  Jupiter reached just over 40 degrees altitude by 10.45pm while the Moon was considerably lower and further east by the time I packed up. The drives were working well all evening. Making centering at 216x much easier than tugging at the telescope with the clutches tightened.

I fiddled with the collimation using a torch to light the folding components but achieved little or nothing. It made no difference to the view of Jupiter. I am tempted to try some different coloured filters but have never really invested. A green, a blue or a red might be worth trying. At least I am getting telescope time and my practicing staring at fuzzy planets must good experience. Had there been fleeting moments of clarity it would have made it seem rather more worthwhile. 

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6 comments:

Unknown said...

Hi Chris,

Just some thoughts which have helped me distinguish possible causes of image problems in the past:

Firstly try examining the slightly de-focused image of a star at reasonably high magnification. If all you see is a boiling mass, the atmosphere is not really steady enough to expect much. If you see a series of light and dark rings, but not centred around the middle of the overall shape, then collimation needs to be adjusted. If you see nice concentric circles but the pattern is markedly different either side of focus, the optics may be pinched or suffering from some issue.

I would also suggest experimenting with wearing a thicker coat or holding your breath whilst carrying out the test, since with an open framed instrument you will be generating some warm air which may interfere with image quality.

Then, looking at Jupiter, first examine the image of one of its moons at high magnification. If you see a lot of gash around the bright circle of the moon even when carefully focused, the optics may not have cooled sufficiently. Also examine Jupiter's limb to see whether it is markedly shimmering - if so, it's possible that warm air currents are rising off some intervening house.

If none of the above is a problem, I'd expect you to see at least the dark blue knots in the lighter central bands, and of course the Red Spot with the hollow around it.

Of course at present, it's all theoretical due to dismal cloud cover...!

Best, Andrew

Chris.B said...

Hi Andrew

Thanks for a very thorough examination of potential optical problems during observation.

I have hardly looked at stars so far so have nothing useful to offer on that subject.
Objective collimation has been slightly relaxed until now. I have concentrated on aligning the folding mirrors to achieve concentricity of the various components as seen through the open focuser. Using he Cheshire EP I have obtained close overlap of the objective reflections but I haven't gone to great lengths to achieve perfection.

I am sorely tempted to go back to the long straight tube for the Mercury transit to achieve the best possible images. I just need a couple of new plates of aluminium to make a more compact, rotary bayonet system for the tube. The added weight of the objective does make mounting the OTA a real struggle since it is so high overhead. I could also add the [rather heavy] OTA balance counterweight after the OTA is fixed safely in the rings.

There has been a "crosswind" during most observation times so I have relaxed any worries about rising body heat spoiling the image. My home lies on the southern border of our garden which does present huge potential problems. Luckily I have been able to peek past the house through a gap which points directly south. Not ideal but thermally clean air is doable from south to east, while ignoring the 8' high hedges.

Jupiter's moons have indeed been useful indicators of seeing conditions. From a spiky mess to smaller and smoother but clearly "softer" seeing.

I suffered from poor planetary seeing for years with the 6" f/8. Which was why I went bigger and longer as a final test of my ability to see fine detail with a refractor.I really ought to finish the 10" f/8 Newtonian just to have useful comparison. Too many other distractions, I'm afraid.

Regards
Chris

Unknown said...

Chris,
I have just re-read your post of 16th March this year where you describe being amazed by the sharpness of the lunar images with this instrument. So hopefully we are just experiencing Jupiter problems due to low altitude and air turbulence rather than anything fundamental.

I would certainly recommend doing some star tests though - and it's worth having a look at a pages such as:

http://www.willbell.com/tm/tm5.htm

http://www.backyardastronomy.com/Backyard_Astronomy/Downloads_files/Appendix%20A-Testing.pdf

http://www.skyatnightmagazine.com/feature/how-guide/how-star-test-telescope

It's a very sensitive way to discover whether the seeing is good, and to get some feel for whether the optics are collimated have cooled, are being affected by local air currents, and are free of major issues. It's also interesting to compare results between different scopes...

Good luck!
Andrew

Chris.B said...

Hi Andrew

Thanks.

What are these things you call stars?

Are they visible through an overcast? ;-)

Chris

Unknown said...

Well one tends to be, albeit somewhat reduced in brilliance, but I wouldn't advise star-testing on that! A

Chris.B said...

A

I've heard a rose-coloured filter will solve all my problems. ;-)

C